By Chris Slawecki

A Conversation With McCoy Tyner -- Don't Just Walk On By

You’d think that declaring native pianist McCoy Tyner as the Honoree of the Mellon PSFS Philadelphia Jazz Festival would be a no-brainer, right? Well, if it makes so much sense, how come it took until 1997 to make it happen?

This honor has been in the planning stages for years. But the demand for performances by this ‘gentle giant’ and elder statesman of jazz piano remains so constant in the states, in Europe and in Japan, that until this season, the Festival’s twelfth, it remained right there -- in the planning stages, not much more.

Tyner began playing piano during his early teen years in the early 1950s, profoundly influenced -- like just about every other pianist of that time -- by the styles of Monk, Powell and Tatum. Tyner’s earliest professional experiences were with trumpeter Lee Morgan, and with saxophonist Benny Golson and trumpet player Art Farmer (with whom Tyner performed in The Jazztet, most notably on the unveiling of Golson’s classic "Killer Joe").

When Philadelphia resident John Coltrane left the Miles Davis Quintet to form his own group in 1960, drummer Elvin Jones and homeboy Tyner came onboard. Their recordings for Impulse!, with bassists Jimmy Garrison, Reggie Workman and Steve Davis -- such masterpieces as A Love Supreme, My Favorite Things and Live at the Village Vanguard -- are among the finest and most influential jazz quartet sessions of the decade. Tyner’s first album as a leader was a trio date with Jones and Art Davis, Inception in 1963. From then on, Tyner-led sessions such as Atlantis and the solo Echoes of a Friend have become pillars in the construction of modern, post-bop, jazz piano.

To celebrate his award, this past June 14, Tyner headlined a program titled "The Real McCoy" at the Mellon PSFS Philly Festival, with his longtime trio (bassist Avery Sharp and drummer Aaron Scott) providing the rhythm section for the Mellon PSFS Ensemble For Unity and featured guests Charles Fambrough, John Blake, Reggie Workman, Al Foster, Ravi Coltrane and others. The pianist’s most recent release is the somewhat surprising The Music of Burt Bacharach (What The World Needs Now), a collection of the composer’s pop tunes rendered by the McCoy Tyner Trio (drummer Louis Nash and bassist Christian McBride) with a symphony orchestra arranged by John Clayton.

"This is a departure from what I normally do but it’s another side of my personality which was very important for me to express," explains Tyner. "I wanted to keep it simple and accentuate the sensitive, more romantic side of my personality, because I do have that side of me that I’m very proud to admit."

In many ways, Tyner being honored for his contributions to jazz in Philadelphia are like a homecoming. But in other significant ways it really isn’t a homecoming at all: because to come home, you need to have left home, and Tyner somehow seems to have left part of himself a Philadelphian even after all these years. In an interview with All About Jazz, the pianist discussed being honored in his hometown, his most recent release, the Underground Railroad, the shy and retiring nature of native Philadelphians, and about getting a life (First of two parts):

Where were you when you found out you were going to be the honoree of this year’s Mellon-PSFS Jazz Festival in your hometown (Philadelphia, PA) ... did you get a letter, did someone call you on the telephone, how were you actually told that you would be the honoree this year?

"Through my agent; Paul called George (Wein, of the organizing Festival Productions) because...well, actually I was playing here in New York at Avery Fisher Hall, and I think we were in the midst of talking about that, and apparently that idea came up in their office, Festival Productions here in New York, and they mentioned that they would like to do that. And George did that for me years ago, maybe fifteen years ago, he honored me and flew me into the Chestnut Cabaret, it might have been fifteen or maybe more. Which was not on this scale; this has been really great, to have the chance to meet the people who are responsible for backing the Mellon Festival, who are very very nice people, and I had a great time that morning (at the introductory press conference)."

Do you in any way feel vindicated now ... which is a much stronger word than I’d really like to use ... but do you in any way feel that now, being recognized like this in your hometown, that all the struggles have been worth it? Is there ANY of that, or is it more the warm glow of satisfaction?

"Well, I don’t have any regrets in my life. I think everything happens for a reason, and whether it’s pleasant or unpleasant, you know, it’s just one of those things. Whether or not we could have made a difference in terms of changing it, I don’t know. Possibly. I just think that things are meant to go the way that they go. Not that we don’t have an influence on our daily life; we do. But I think that I tried to travel this course as well as I could, and I tried to have a little fun and enjoyment along the way. Try to be as productive as possible. But, coming back to Philly is always a pleasure, because that’s my roots."

What IS it about Philadelphia (and I KNOW you’ve been asked this question a hundred times)? Bud Powell lived around the corner from you at one point. Is there any way that you can begin to describe what the music scene was like where you grew up in Philadelphia?

"Historically, from a black perspective (and I’m just saying that because, you know, we know, what jazz has meant to the black community through the years, especially all during the last fifty years or whatever), it was what I would maybe say was officially the end of the underground railroad with Harriet Tubman. So you have a lot of well-respected black churches and other institutions that were established. The Pennsylvania Dutch played a very very important part in making that happen, because what they did was assist her; a lot of people ran away from the plantations, and when they got to Pennsylvania, the Dutch hid ‘em like under the floors and wherever, and it allowed the institutions to be established in Philly. The African Methodist Church was established there, I think they had newspapers, whatever. Culturally speaking, Philly has been at the helm of that expression. And then, for some reason, there’s another element that’s added; I mean, we’ve got a guy like Pat Martino, there’s Eddie Fisher, you see, a lot of people from Little Italy, Sylvester Stallone, all the rock’n’roll people, and The Stylistics...I mean, the city’s unbelievable! I can’t even begin to...and let’s establish this is one perspective. Then you have to consider all the other things."

"Like Mike Brecker was on my last record -- I mean, I just did one, but the last one, that won a Grammy (Infinity), he’s from Philly. So we always talk about Philadelphia, and when I see him we always talk about Philadelphia. When I see Bill Cosby, I see him periodically, Philly comes up. If I’m in another state playing or somewhere, or sometimes even out of the country, a Philadelphia person will come up. I’ve met students abroad and different people from Philly, and they’ll all come up and say something. There’s something about the city that stays with you all your life. It’s really funny."

Just for the record, you’ve received other Grammy Awards for...?

"Journey was one, we had two big band dates and one was called Journey, and the other was called Turning Point."

Has there been any less-than-positive reaction in the ‘jazz community’ to your covering an album of Burt Bacharach ‘pop’ tunes?

"No, actually it’s kind of funny, because when I walked into the studio I had no idea of the magnitude in terms of people who were going to be on it -- there were guys from my big band, people I knew, because they put that orchestra together, and I’ve gotten, actually, positive response. Because of the fact that, "The Look of Love," for instance, I really opened up on that tune, and I just played in my regular way. Louis Nash and Christian McBride, who’s also from Philly, did a great job. I met Burt, Burt was very happy, he even said himself, when Tommy LiPuma mentioned the fact that I wanted to do his music, because I had my choice, I could either do this or something else, and I chose to do his music. But I think some of melodies really stand up, and they’ve been around a long time."

This seemed to help bring out something about yourself too. People seem to consistently notice what one might call your more powerful, propulsive style, and legitimately so, but The Music of Burt Bacharach seems to draw out your more romantic side.

"That’s one of the reasons why I did it."

Might there be another one of these in your future?

"I haven’t thought of a sequel or anything, but I’m not that kind of guy. Usually I do things in contrasts. Periodically, I kind of do things like this, like with voices in "Flower of the Wind," I’ll do something off the beaten path. But I really wanted to do this, because I’m not a one-dimensional kind of guy. I think people seem to want to put you in a niche, ‘Let’s lock him away and let him stay there’. But I’m not like that."

If you had to compare the way you play on this album to a vocalist -- obviously, when you think of Burt Bacharach you think of Dionne Warwick -- who is your favorite singer right now?

"Billie Holiday, I think. In terms of someone I feel is kind of immortal, she would be that person. She’s wonderful. I had a chance to meet her; in Philly actually, I was at Pep’s and just couldn’t get there. But I met Sarah Vaughan and Ella Fitzgerald ... I knew and loved them both tremendously."

It’s not that much a stretch to see you diving into the Rogers & Hart songbook from here.

"That might be nice, to do something periodically, to often do something like that. I think this sort of set a precedent; it shows that the possibility of doing this….see, the reason we didn’t want to go in that direction, and we went in Burt’s direction instead, is that a lot of that music has been done over and over and over. Even ME, I’ve even recorded some Gershwin and Ellington. And I thought that maybe doing Burt’s would be something different. We tried to pick the best stuff that we could, that would help, that I could use as a vehicle for MY expression."

Could you pick out say maybe two or three titles that you are most satisfied with?

"A House Is Not A Home," I like "Alfie" and "The Look of Love," and there’s one more…that really had a nice groove and a real dramatic beginning, I think it’s "The Windows of the World," it’s a real dynamic, forceful swinging kind of a thing. That one, yeah."

There has been much written about your piano playing. But how would you describe McCoy Tyner when you’re away from the piano?

"I’m just an average guy. When I say ‘average guy,’ I mean I like…just simple things. I like to go out to a movie now and then, to a musical or some sort of play; I saw "Phantom of the Opera" and I saw "Cats". When friends from Europe would come over and say ‘Let’s go see ‘Cats’’ I would say, ‘Well I’ve seen it three times already…I’ll see it again!’ I like occasionally to cook, I like to go to the park with friends. I have close friends, and I just spend time with them. I like to write music, but even away from the music, I like to have a LIFE. Outside of music. Just constantly thinking about music all the time…actually, I think, part of my being a successful musician is the fact that I do have a life apart from music. Sometimes this isn’t something that you pick, this is something that picks you."

How do you try to strike that blend of emotion and structure when you’re playing a solo piano piece?

"Getting back to your previous question, about having a life or experiencing things on a regular scale, outside of music, I think it really adds a lot to your being. It gives you something else -- something to inspire it, to give it that thing that makes it meaningful. If you have a life and it’s not just one dimensional -- ‘Oh, I just play music all the time’ -- that is not enough. You gotta have a life, you gotta have people you interact with, you gotta do things that are just…fun. You gotta have fun in life. And I think that’s what gives you, gives me, gives anybody I guess, the passion and the means to express the different human aspects. Which are very very important when you’re playing music, you know? I’d like to be able to play something and have a person come up and say, ‘You know, I really liked it, I really felt something from the music, and it reminded me of something in my life.’ Obviously, it reminds me of something in MY life, if that’s what you heard. You’ve got to be able to relate certain things, not only to yourself but to other people."

Is there a pianist now that kind of reminds you of yourself?

"Well, there’s no ONE guy right at the moment, but there ARE guys coming up. There are guys coming up who are very very serious about playing the instrument. And I think that it takes years to really learn that word "instrument" -- that’s what it is. It’s a vehicle to an expression. But you don’t realize it until you’ve played for twenty-some odd years or thirty-some, or whatever; I think that you really realize that’s what it is -- it doesn’t exist alone. It’s just an instrument, and you’re the one who takes command of that, when you sit down; I don’t mean ‘command,’ but you should become one. And that one-ness is like a marriage -- if people are close, they spend time together then they become like one, then it’s sort of a wonderful experience. Well, playing is the same thing." "The only thing I would like to say is, I hope that, with all of the technological advances that we’re making, that we don’t fail to remember that there are things like music, like in live performances, that there are people playing the music who need people to listen to it, other than just listening to it on a CD or cassette -- personal appearances are very important, and it’s good for people to show up. Sometimes things happen that don’t happen in the studio."

Have you heard your own music sampled on a hip-hop or rap record yet?

"I haven’t, not yet. I’m not saying it doesn’t exist. You know, Coolio is one the same label that I’m on, Impulse is owned by MCA, and I was just wondering…I saw him but I didn’t get a chance to talk to him at the Grammy Awards."